Joined: Dec 03, 2009 Posts: 118 Location: United Kingdom
Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2019 10:59 am Post subject: Rust in Fuel Tank
Guys
I have recently have had a new Fuel tank fabricated for my M38A1 (about a 18 months ago). During the winter it has been stored in my Garage with some fuel in it that is about a year old, tank was about half full.
Every couple of weeks or so started the Jeep up and let run when weather permitting tool it for run of a couple of miles or so (cannot go any further due to incomplete body work)
Today got a Jerrican of new fuel to add to the tank and for some reason shone a torch into the tank and the area below the filler on the bottom of the tank has a coating of red rust on the base of the tank, no loose particles, sides of tank not too bad. No water globules on top of fuel.
Question for a novice... is this normal and due to the new unleaded type of fuels, could it also be as a result of condensation?
Is there any additives that can help that can be added to the fuel?
You shown a TORCH in the tank? That can't be a good idea.
As far as the gas goes, yes, the unleaded and ethanol stuff will deteriorate; I did a Google search and all kinds of bad things happen from higher octane due to evaporation, water from condensation, rust from that too, and general degradation of its ability to burn. And a rancid smell.
I have the same problem as I don't drive my vehicles much. And I once had a carb clogged up from Stay Bil, so I don't use it any more. _________________ M38 23100 June 51
M38 34523 Sep 51
M606/CJ3B 1964 Kaiser 57348 118458
M37B1 1963
Willys MB 1944
Ford GPW 1942
Dodge WC63 1943
Dodge Power Wagon WM300 1967
Plymouth Barracuda, 1973, 340 4 barrel
All ground up restored by me.
Lots of others.
Joined: Jul 21, 2017 Posts: 18 Location: Rhode Island
Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2019 2:38 pm Post subject:
Hi,
Not to butt in but please give this gentleman a hall pass on his use of “torch”, being he is from the UK that’s a common term for a flashlight...
Really enjoy this board for all the hints,tips and topics !
Thanks _________________ Dave
Rhode Island
Willy’s MC / M38
Build date August of 1951
S/N MC 31118
Proudly helping her to stay active in her retired years ...
Water is heavier then gas and will settle to the bottom, not float on top. Water goblets that float are usually entrapped in oil which is lighter than gas.
The water at the bottom already has the Oxygen in it to support the corrosion. Condensation aggravates the situation when the tank is left less than full. The moisture in the air collects on the bare tank skin above the fuel then gravity takes it to the bottom.
To prevent corrosion during storage you must either leave the tank full into the filler pipe or bone dry. If you choose bone dry then you must fog the interior of the tank with a light oil to prevent any oxidation of the bare metal.
As always I know someone will brag on how nice his specially coated tank interior holds up but if you choose to go this route try first to find someone who has experienced the long term (over 5 or 10 years) deterioration of these miracle coatings and the ensuing grief they endured unclogging their fuel supply system and removing the remains of these nasty coatings. _________________ Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100
Joined: Nov 01, 2017 Posts: 167 Location: Richmond, BC Canada
Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2019 11:29 pm Post subject:
We used to use methyl hydrate. It will mix with water and burn away. If you have a lot of water then time to drain and dry. _________________ Lyle
LT-RCEME, Retired
________________
Jeep Rubicon, 2015
M38 CDN, 1952
M416, 1968
Joined: Dec 03, 2009 Posts: 118 Location: United Kingdom
Posted: Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:09 am Post subject:
Thank you guys for your replies it is much appreciated.
Even though the tank bottom under the filler is completely covered it looks like surface rust with no floating bits is it best just to monitor for now?
As I said earlier the tank side from what I can see look good.
Simple answer Yes, drain and thoroughly clean the tank. Don't overlook the fuel strainer. It to should be removed and cleaned.
Unless you cut the tank open or explore with an expensive bore scope you cannot see all of the interior.
You didn't mention what material you had your new tank fabricated from and if the new tank mirrors perfectly the old tank? _________________ Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100
Joined: Dec 03, 2009 Posts: 118 Location: United Kingdom
Posted: Mon Mar 18, 2019 11:27 am Post subject:
Wes
The tank was made to the exact same dimensions and was made out of some form of steel by a professional tank company.
However the bottom area under the filler was made out of the original bottom of the old tank, oddly enough this is the area which is coated with the rust!!
Sides etc. look good that I can see these are newly fabricated.
Some day I am hoping the fellow in the upper midwest US that used to produce stainless steel new replacement M38/M38A1 tanks will re-open his business! Stainless steel is the best shot we have at quality tanks. _________________ Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100
Joined: Dec 20, 2007 Posts: 10 Location: Caledonia, NY, 1 hr from Canada
Posted: Wed Mar 20, 2019 3:55 am Post subject: Fuel tank
There are coatings that hold up, they are used in railroad cars and petroleum tanks. They are expensive to have done properly, and most guys go for the inexpensive do it yourself route. I had my original Halftrack tank done years ago commercially and its fine,but it cost more than a new tank.
Over here in the states, i get ethanol free gas and use John Deere Fuel treatment. That works well here because everything is stored for 7 months whilst it’s snowing here. Another thing that may help....
I would suggest you go over to your local John Deere dealer, and ask for their fuel treatment. It won’t jell or cause problems like have happened with Stabil fuel treatment. The JD stuff works great in the tractors, and in my military vehicles too. John Deere & Caterpillar are also great places to get certified strength bolts and fasteners for your vehicles. Just my two cents.
Have fun with your jeep! _________________ Have fun with your jeep!
1942 GPW, 1951 M38, 1952 M38A1, 1953 M37, 1942 M3 HT
Caledonia, NY, about 1 hr from Canada
*1952 M38A1 Ser#18822 Dod 9/52 Ord Dept, Depot USMC *
It is that inexpensive do it yourself route that produces the problems. And it is the high cost that drives folks to experiment with the inexpensive route. _________________ Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100
Being new here and sorting through the forums I came across a subject I am very well experienced in. Being located on the west coast of Florida we have millions of boaters that share this or similar issues. Most of the fuel tanks here are aluminum so rust is now the normal issue but bad fuel is.
Being sailors and returning from Cuba in 99' we experienced a dirty fuel tank. Once back home/in port I attempted to 'polish the fuel'.
Fast forward nine years - we started a company cleaning fuel tanks, all sizes. One sector of our market is motorcycles, or as the EMT refer to as donor cycles. Motorcycle tanks share alot of the same issues these old vintage machines share - rusty tanks. The prep work for cleaning a tank prior to appling a coating is no less than 10 days. We have have numerous tanks come in that were coated and due to not being prepped, the cost and recoat is outrageous. I truly do not recommend a DIY tank coating.
Joined: Feb 14, 2014 Posts: 31 Location: Dunedin, Florida
Posted: Thu Mar 21, 2019 6:45 pm Post subject:
The ethanol in today’s fuel is very corrosive and attracts moisture as well.Several years ago we had a rash of fuel tank sender failures across the south when too much ethanol was in the fuel.The corrosion is also why most automotive fuel tanks are plastics that are not bothered by ethanol.look hard and you might find a station that carry’s ethanol free fuel usually for boats and farm equipment. I have three near because we have a lot of boats. You might call a boat dealer to ask if he knows of a station.
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