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Looking for Ramsey 50 shaft u joint
FS: 1951 M38, Texas
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willysmjeeps.com :: View topic - I just noticed
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I just noticed
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Deadguy
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Joined: Jun 09, 2011
Posts: 776
Location: Bellmore, NY

PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 4:16 pm    Post subject: I just noticed Reply with quote

That the driver's side droops lower than the passenger side. I tried moving the vehicle around, and even reversing it's position on the same swatch of pavement, and the driver's side is always about 1 1/2 inch lower. I'm guessing this is probably a shock issue? I didn't notice it before, and recently my vehicle has begun to vibrate a bit more than normal at higher speeds. The leaf springs are fairly new, as are the shocks actually. I replaced them with ones Kaiser Willys sold me two years ago. They turned out to be just Monroe shocks, and I did have that recent abrupt, higher speed meetup with a curb on the drivers side.
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1952 M38A1
Marine core reinforced rear bumper, military transistorized turn signal upgrade, arctic heater, 11" drum brakes, 200L PTO winch, Huffy overdrive, deep water fording kit, RT 68 vehicle mounted radio, Trac Locs front and rear.
www.danhenk.com
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Deadguy
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Posts: 776
Location: Bellmore, NY

PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just read what you posted on the G503 message board Wes, about how the universal spring sets have the military vehicles leaning to the driver's side. I got my leaf springs from Kaiser Willys as well, and i know they have less leaves than stock. Two years ago, when i bought them, Mike at Kaiser Willys was telling me that they don't make the originals anymore, and the additional springs just make the ride stiffer anyways. I have learned not to trust these guys in the time since, what is your take Wes?
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1952 M38A1
Marine core reinforced rear bumper, military transistorized turn signal upgrade, arctic heater, 11" drum brakes, 200L PTO winch, Huffy overdrive, deep water fording kit, RT 68 vehicle mounted radio, Trac Locs front and rear.
www.danhenk.com
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wesk
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Joined: Apr 04, 2005
Posts: 15962
Location: Wisconsin

PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you search long enough this topic has been discussed a hundred times.

The lean is caused by weight which is biased towards the driver's side. The engine is offset to the left. The gas tank is on the left and the driver sits on the left. This left (driver's side) weight bias fatigues the left springs first.

The simple solution is to shim the right rear corner of the jeep down an equal amount by inserting the proper thickness shim between the right side axle tube and the spring pack.
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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php
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Deadguy
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 8:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have aftermarket leaf springs with less leaves and more curvature than the military ones. Where the military issue springs less susceptible to this problem?
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1952 M38A1
Marine core reinforced rear bumper, military transistorized turn signal upgrade, arctic heater, 11" drum brakes, 200L PTO winch, Huffy overdrive, deep water fording kit, RT 68 vehicle mounted radio, Trac Locs front and rear.
www.danhenk.com
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wesk
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Every old CJ and MB/MC/MD I have ever seen with it's matching original springs sags to the driver's side. Until someone offers a different spring rate for the left side that will always be the case unless one compensates as I have mentioned above by shimming the right side down lower.
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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php
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Deadguy
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 9:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry about the ignorance, but how do I shim the right side down Wes/
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1952 M38A1
Marine core reinforced rear bumper, military transistorized turn signal upgrade, arctic heater, 11" drum brakes, 200L PTO winch, Huffy overdrive, deep water fording kit, RT 68 vehicle mounted radio, Trac Locs front and rear.
www.danhenk.com
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wesk
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 10:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Counting this post as #1 then in the fourth post up from here read my 3rd sentence again!
Quote:
The simple solution is................

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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php
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jimm
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Joined: Nov 01, 2011
Posts: 199
Location: Escondido, CA

PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 11:37 pm    Post subject: Re: I just noticed Reply with quote

Deadguy wrote:
I'm guessing this is probably a shock issue?

Shocks don't hold up static weight against gravity - springs do that. You can push or pull a shock absorber piston from one end of its travel to the other by hand, slowly. The springs let the axles and frame/body move relative to each other when you go over a bump, and the shocks are there to control the motion after the bump by converting the "bouncing" (kinetic) energy to heat energy in the fluid in the shock. That's why they're called shock absorbers - they absorb the energy of the shock and prevent the vehicle from continuing to go boingy-boingy on the springs - a not only uncomfortable, but dangerous, condition because it affects handling and control of the vehicle.
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Jim McKim
1952 M38 son-father project
Slowly turning rusty parts into OD parts
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Deadguy
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2013 2:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I understand the concept Wes, I guess I mainly just have a few technical questions. Like, do the shims go between the axle and the leaf spring plate? What dimensions should I get, and where would you suggest I get them? I had no problem getting axle shims when i did the wheel bearings, but i have no idea where to get body shims. I see CJ shims primarily for lifted jeeps, and most are angled.
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1952 M38A1
Marine core reinforced rear bumper, military transistorized turn signal upgrade, arctic heater, 11" drum brakes, 200L PTO winch, Huffy overdrive, deep water fording kit, RT 68 vehicle mounted radio, Trac Locs front and rear.
www.danhenk.com
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Bretto
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Joined: Nov 24, 2010
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Location: Orem, UT

PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2013 8:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What do you mean body shims?
Axle/spring shims would go between the axle perch and spring pack. You would also need new longer clips (u-bolts). If you do get them, don't settle on cast aluminum shims, get steel. The aluminum ones will slowly crush.
Or just live with the the lean like most do. Its not a big deal.
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Brett
'51 M38
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wesk
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2013 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let's go easy on Dan. Here's the thousand word picture Dan:



The illustration is the left rear of the M38 but applies equally to all four springs on the M38, M38A1, M170
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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php
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Deadguy
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2013 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Wes. All the ones that I see are angled. Is that bad?
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1952 M38A1
Marine core reinforced rear bumper, military transistorized turn signal upgrade, arctic heater, 11" drum brakes, 200L PTO winch, Huffy overdrive, deep water fording kit, RT 68 vehicle mounted radio, Trac Locs front and rear.
www.danhenk.com
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Bretto
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Joined: Nov 24, 2010
Posts: 1390
Location: Orem, UT

PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2013 12:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't get angled ones, they are for changing the pinion/driveline angle. If you cant find them, just get some steel stock of the thickness you need and cut to shape of the perch.
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Brett
'51 M38
PHOTO DIARY OF MY BUILD
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wesk
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2013 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually you can use the angled ones just install them in pairs opposed to each other so there is no angle change.
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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php
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Powermwt
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Joined: Apr 13, 2005
Posts: 53
Location: Fort Worth Texas

PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2013 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You know the early WWII jeep had different spring rates for the front set and I'm sure the engineers at Willys Overland knew of the jeep leaning.

Yet when they changed to heavier springs later in the war, they did nothing to correct the lean, even making the front springs the same rate.

If your jeep does not lean I make think there is something wrong with it.

So, you all are saying to shim to correct an aesthetic issue?
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