Joined: Jan 29, 2015 Posts: 8 Location: Kingwood, TX
Posted: Thu Jan 29, 2015 12:25 pm Post subject: Introduction and Updates
Hello all...to begin with I was unsure of which section to post this in, however, I was going to introduce myself and my Jeep...plus maybe ask a couple of questions.
To begin with the information that I do know about the Jeep is somewhat clouded. My M38A1 has been through a few owners that were all friends of the family. To begin with my dad's best friend bought the Jeep first. According to said friend, it was a 1956 M38A1 that was a communications Jeep. He said when he originally acquired the Jeep that it had a bunch of wires and antennae for the com's, but of course he was buying it to be a hunting Jeep so all of that was stripped out. Then it was sold to another friend and eventually my dad ended up with this monstrosity. Now the years have passed and my dad has passed the Jeep on to me.
I intend to still use the Jeep as a hunting Jeep, but I am working to clean it up and make it somewhat correct. It will still have a high backseat and not be perfect by any means, but my goal is to make it look better.
Sorry...I kind of trailed off...anyhow, the uncertainty of the year model begins with the original owner saying it is a 1956. My mother swears that the title says it is a 1958, but hasn't found it yet. The data plate on the dash (which is in absolutely terrible condition) has a delivery date of 8/53 and the serial number is 55384. The aluminum data plate behind the passenger seat (which took a lot of work to clean up) has MB 55384 on it. It is a Willys-Overland data plate.
The Jeep has the one piece windshield, it was orignially 24v (dad changed it to 12v to buy less batteries I guess), I am confident that the gas tank is incorrect, my dad put an adjustable driver's seat in it, no original back seat (I think what was in it came out of a pickup), it has been welded on, beat on and abused for a lot of years. When ordering parts this morning, I was getting some new shackles and bolts for the suspension, and the guy made a comment that the setup was only done for a couple of years say between 52 and up to early 55 year models. Both springs are setup identically with the spring mounted in the front with a bolt and shackles at the rear and both extending to the bumpers almost. I have downloaded the survey and will try to fill out a lot of that this evening in order to contribute to the data base, but I don't really know a lot about the vehicle other than the years we used it at the deer lease.
As for being "Pink"...well it will have to stay that color. Part of the agreement during all of the transactions from friend to friend and eventually me, the caveat has always been that it has to stay "Pink". So pink it shall stay. If I can figure out how to post pictures I will put some up.
My questions are as follows:
1 - Is there a way to confirm what branch this Jeep may have served in?
2 - Are there any good resources for decent used parts, one being the gas tank, its hard to spend $500 on a reproduction
3 - General ideas to help me get a better history of this thing
4 - Advice for trying to make this thing functional/somewhat period specific
5 - Anyone near Houston, TX that likes to tinker??? Haha
6 - Transmission/transfer case gear oil - I've read that you have to be careful what oil you put in them or it will eat the synchronizers...any truth to this?
7 - How to refill the transmission/transfer case after draining them out? HAHA!
List of things done so far:
When I loaded it up on the trailer it didn't run and the tires were flat.
Bought a battery
Changed fuel filters
Changed the oil and oil filter
Changed spark plugs
Changed thermostat - old one was stuck and wouldn't open
Added coolant - need to drain and refill
Drained and refilled the differentials
Ordered new backseat
Ordered new air cleaner hose
Ordered brake line kit - with rubber hoses for the front and rear to replace those as well
Ordered tranny boot
Ordered transfer case boot
Ordered shackle kit to replace those old tired ones that are in it
Ordered bell crank rebuild kit
Ordered drag link rebuild kit
Ordered new tie rod assemblies for driver and passenger side
Ordered thermostat housing
Ordered lower and upper radiator hoses
Clip on the distributor for the distributor cap is broken, so i'm going to try to drill out the rivets and replace it with a new one (have a wrong distributor with the right clip to rob it off of)
Anyhow...I have rambled enough and look forward to bugging all of you for information and how to's
Last edited by pokorn28 on Fri Jul 31, 2015 10:37 am; edited 1 time in total
As the saying goes if it looks like a duck then it's a duck. She's a 8-53 MD55384 and that's all there is to it. I think the MB 55384 on the patent plate is actually MD 55384. Many times the surplus military vehicles were often titled with the year they were surplused. It's possible the first family bud that bought it at surplus auction and failed to hang onto the original SF94 that was issued for that sale registered it as a 56 or 58 if your mom is correct. The key is what number was used for the serial. Up to the early 70's it was common in many states to title vehicles with their engine numbers.
You asked?
Quote:
1 - Is there a way to confirm what branch this Jeep may have served in?
2 - Are there any good resources for decent used parts, one being the gas tank, its hard to spend $500 on a reproduction
3 - General ideas to help me get a better history of this thing
4 - Advice for trying to make this thing functional/somewhat period specific
5 - Anyone near Houston, TX that likes to tinker??? Haha
6 - Transmission/transfer case gear oil - I've read that you have to be careful what oil you put in them or it will eat the synchronizers...any truth to this?
7 - How to refill the transmission/transfer case after draining them out? HAHA!
1-Look at the lower left plate on the dash. If both columns say Ordnance then the jeep probably went to the Army or Air Force. By 53 most Air Force stuff was getting painted blue so your paint can help with this question. If one column says Ordnance and the other says USMC or USN then that's where the jeep went. Marine Corp Forest green or Navy gray paint can help with this question.
2-Nope. Gas tanks are like gold. The best thing to do is buy a rusted original and replace all the rusted metal. Don't waste time trying glue all the rust holes shut or applying all the miracle goop to the inside of the tank. Just reskin it and be happy with a rustfree tank for another 20 years.
The Big MV parts dealers that offer specific help with M38's, M38A1's and M170's are:
Midwest Military
Ron Fitzpatrick
Army Jeeps Parts
Daryl Bensinger
Rapco
Dealers for general M series stuff:
Saturn Surplus
Memphis Equipment
Star Electric
Some of the CJ5 stuff works.
3-The Army did not retain service histories on their wheeled vehicles. Sanding paint layers to find old unit markings is as close as you will get to finding any history on your jeep.
4-You need to ask this question one topic at a time as you come to the issues on the technical page.
5-Houston! Got your ears on?
6-Yes you should avoid using high sulpher content modern gear oils at least in the tranny. Hypoid gears oil were made for the differentials. Over the years the public wanted a one lube does it all thing and the specialized tranny gear oils that were not Hypoid types have almost all vanished. The tractor dealers are still tranny lube smart as are the antique Ford differential guys. If you call a Hypoid oil salesman he will feed you the line that his High Sulpher product is ok to use in your gearbox. Not his restored trucks gearbox - yours!
7-Get a suck tube and suck blow it in!
All the M38A1's came with a two piece windshield. Someone dropped the center divider on yours or installed a CJ5 windshield.
The reverse spring shackle thing on the front was all M38A1's from 1952 thru 1971 came that way. The CJ5 only had the reversed shackles for 55/56. _________________ Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100
Joined: May 30, 2014 Posts: 3447 Location: Texas Hill Country
Posted: Thu Jan 29, 2015 6:13 pm Post subject:
Well I have family in Spring and Conroe but I'm in the Hill Country.
Brent Mullins is in College Station. He has not only a business
selling parts but a museum as well. He sells over the phone,
Internet and EBay. Army Jeep Parts is in Bowie.
I've had very good experience with John at Midwest, and Ron Fitzpatrick
as well as a host of others.
In most cases advice is worth what you pay for it. Not here.
Lots of folks have burned lots of hours making mistakes they will
gladly help you avoid. Be polite, and offer help when you can.
Free is free except here, where it is worth much more.
Joined: Jan 29, 2015 Posts: 8 Location: Kingwood, TX
Posted: Thu Jan 29, 2015 8:24 pm Post subject:
Thanks a ton for the responses. I've been outside this evening despite a disappointed wife and upset kid to pull the floor plate loose and taking pictures of the markings/plates I run across for the survey. The data plates are in terrible shape and my wife used ketchup on it yesterday to help clean them up....not really sure if they supposed to shine all brassy like but I'm just trying to get them where they can be read.
I appreciate all the info Wesk. There is a gas tank on eBay but it's in Athens Greece and I'm a little wary of buying things out of the U.S. I was burned on it once before, so I guess I'll keep my eye out for one within the states.
I have been using Vintage Jeeps in Beasley, TX; Russel seems very knowledgeable and his prices are very competitive with what I've seen so far for parts. I will most likely be bugging you guys for sure about the tech stuff, I have learned over the years that you can learn a ton from people if you just listen a little and have an open mind (without sounding to liberal here).
I'll keep you guys posted and try to get some pictures up when I can...thanks again for the info!!! Oh and you were correct with the MD...I didn't recall the number right earlier from the plate on the wheel well. _________________ John
1953 M38A1 - Hunting Jeep
Joined: Mar 26, 2012 Posts: 189 Location: Lexington Park Maryland (Southern Maryland)
Posted: Fri Jan 30, 2015 11:48 am Post subject:
As it has been stated many times before most of your questions have been asked once before. When working on my jeep I will do a Google search for the question. For example I search " M38A1 factory paint willysmjeeps" on Google and it will find the threads here on the site. I then read through the threads and see if I get an answer. I have actually found an answer for 80% of my questions before asking anything. When I don't understand I then ask the question. One benefit of doing this that I have found invaluable is I actually learn more doing this. I will read about the topic and the thread may then touch something else that I wasn't thinking about or the Google search finds other topics I then read about. It does steer you away from your original focus but may help you later on. I actually have a Word document on my computer with the links to all the threads I need so I can reference them later when I reach that point. It also includes reminders and suggestions for me to look at when I reach that point in the restoration as well. _________________ TJ
53 M38A1 (project)
3/28/45 MB factory restoration project
Joined: Jan 29, 2015 Posts: 8 Location: Kingwood, TX
Posted: Tue Feb 10, 2015 10:16 am Post subject:
I got a lot of parts in last week and was able to work on the Jeep a little over the weekend.
So far, I have rebuilt the bell crank, rebuilt the drag link and gotten all of the brake lines replaced. I'm hoping to get the shackles/spring bolts replaced this weekend and possibly re-plumb all of the fuel lines/tank stuff if I can get the parts quick enough. I decided to order a new tank, fuel lines and all of the associated parts for the fuel tank. May as well go with new stuff and hopefully it will last another 60 years!
Also got some pictures uploaded to the gallery! _________________ John
1953 M38A1 - Hunting Jeep
When you get your new tank be sure to check the following:
Alignment of screw holes in tank with the filter housing and the sender.
Alignment angle and height of filler neck vs opening in side of the jeep. Keep in mind that there should be 1/8" thick rubber strips under the tank.
Tank height vs seat bottom.
If tank does not come with filler sliding screen check the fit of your old sliding screen with the new tank's filler pipe.
Check these before you commit to installing the tank. _________________ Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100
Joined: Jan 29, 2015 Posts: 8 Location: Kingwood, TX
Posted: Tue Feb 10, 2015 12:04 pm Post subject:
Thanks for the pointers Wes...I will make sure to check those out before I commit to installing the tank. Something has to go in there at some point though, the tank that was in it was a tank out of a CJ and whoever put it in drilled a couple of new holes for the fuel line to come out of the bottom. They also put a rubber hose from the tank and had it wired up off of the exhaust pipe with bailing wire. I know it worked for a lot of years, but I would like to have everything working on it that should be working on it. Next big project will be the wiring and trying to get all of the lights to work. The body is beat up pretty bad and there are quite a few things missing. A lot of the old wiring was simply cut out and there are pieces hanging everywhere. I don't ever remember the speedometer or the fuel indicator working.
You guys would probably look at the pictures and say that it is a good candidate for donor parts, but I am sentimentally attached to this beast. Now I am just trying to figure out how to salvage what is left to make it work for me. It probably won't ever be in decent enough condition to be driven on the road or to show up in a parade for sure, but it'll be mine. _________________ John
1953 M38A1 - Hunting Jeep
Joined: May 30, 2014 Posts: 3447 Location: Texas Hill Country
Posted: Mon Feb 16, 2015 11:15 am Post subject:
Hi John,
You mentioned rebuilding the bell crank and drag link. Be sure and check the tie rods and ends, as well as the kingpin bearings. The latter is easily checked by jacking up the front wheels and grabbing the wheel and shaking it for play. Search the posts here. There is a very specific way to shake the wheel, I believe top to bottom, but it may be left to right.
The other thing is steering wheel play. How much does the wheel turn before it moves anything up front? Is the sector shaft bearing and steering box in good shape?
The reason I ask is it sounds like you are looking to check the right things to make it a driver and everything from the wheels/hubs to the steering wheel need to be checked.
Man, that is a lot of iron on that thing! Has the suspension been beefed up? It sure looks like it is carrying it fairly level.
Take care,
Brian
ps: You know deer are colorblind. Have you seen the camo paint job that is pink and black?
Joined: Jan 29, 2015 Posts: 8 Location: Kingwood, TX
Posted: Mon Feb 16, 2015 10:29 pm Post subject:
Hey Brian...thanks for the suggestions. I had been thinking about what else I needed to do in order to ensure no issues with the front end. So I ordered an entire rebuild kit for the king pins, new wheel bearings/races for the front and rear, respective seal kits and I will probably get the springs rebuilt at some point. I should probably rebuild the brakes while I'm at it, but I'll order that stuff a little later. (She sits a little low on the left front as it is). However, I did get my fuel lines and new fuel tank. The tank strap that was in the Jeep will not fit over the tank. But I don't know if it is the right tank strap anyhow. (May just make one out of some flat strap from Tractor Supply). I'll keep you guys posted with how things are going!
Hopefully I'll get the remainder of the parts in this week and it should give me quite a bit to do over the weekend. _________________ John
1953 M38A1 - Hunting Jeep
Joined: Jan 29, 2015 Posts: 8 Location: Kingwood, TX
Posted: Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:07 am Post subject:
So it has been a while since I have posted in this thread, figured I would give some updates.
I have gotten the steering components completely rebuilt, for the most part. I ended up replacing the entire tie rod assembly (mostly because it was just as cheap as ordering all of the tie rods & I kept the old assembly). I also finally tackled the king pins. For some reason I was hesitant to do those, but it worked out okay in the end. Ended up going with a mixture of 140w GL-3 lubricant with some honey oil mixed in it to put back in the steering knuckles.
I am currently working on rebuilding the steering box. Once I get the steering box done, the death wobble will hopefully be gone.
I ordered a lot of parts over the last couple of weeks. New steering wheel, steering shaft tube, canvas for the seats, and a lot of other cosmetic parts/pieces. Mechanically, I ordered a ton of parts as well. Everything from fuel tank parts/pieces to a NOS YS-950 carburetor. Since installing the new fuel tank/fuel lines, I have had a lot of trouble getting the Jeep to run. I have no idea what carburetor is mounted, but I found a NOS YS-950 for $260 on Ebay and couldn't pass it up. I have primed the fuel lines, got fuel in the glass fuel bowl on the pump (I know it isn't the right pump) and when I disconnect the line going into the carburetor, I can get fuel to come out without any issues. So I am hoping when I get the new carb in that it will solve my issues.
Next thing will be to get tires for it and do some fabrication work to get the seats back in where they need to go. After that, it should be ready for hunting season this year. _________________ John
1953 M38A1 - Hunting Jeep
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