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USAID Plate
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SK
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Joined: Jun 07, 2020
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2020 3:34 am    Post subject: USAID Plate Reply with quote



On the plate it's written "UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AGENCY FOR INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT 1" & "UP" stamped in last, what is mean by this? Can anyone go in depth of this plate.

_________
Best,
SK


Last edited by SK on Sat Aug 15, 2020 3:11 am; edited 1 time in total
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Ryan_Miller
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2020 6:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is an agency which provides aid to foreign governments - USAID
The work all over the world, I worked with them when I was deployed to Afghanistan with the U.S. Army.
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whydahdvr
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2020 7:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Often in movies you'll see that stamped on bags of grain or rice or other foodstuffs but USAID covers a lot of territory and aid offerings. They're affiliated with the US State Department.
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RonD2
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2020 8:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very interesting find!

Curious, is that plate riveted to an engine? Or frame? Or body?

Too bad there's no date on it (when the jeep was "donated"), and who (what country) it was donated to.

I always thought that USAID provides surplus U.S. Government Property to counterpart civilian agencies of friendly foreign governments, but not for the military. USAID donating tanks and guns too? Didn't the CIA run guns through USAID in SEA during the 1960's and 1970's, or is that urban legend? I thought "Military Assistance" wasn't handled by USAID, but could be mistaken.
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whydahdvr
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2020 9:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here are the links and descriptions from USAID's website and from Wikipedia. Useful for perspective.

https://www.usaid.gov
USAID is the world's premier international development agency and a catalytic actor driving development results. USAID's work advances U.S. national security and economic prosperity, demonstrates American generosity, and promotes a path to recipient self-reliance and resilience.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Agency_for_International_Development
The United States Agency for International Development (USAID) is an independent agency of the United States federal government that is primarily responsible for administering civilian foreign aid and development assistance. With a budget of over $27 billion, USAID is one of the largest official aid agencies in the world, and accounts for more than half of all U.S. foreign assistance—the highest in the world in absolute dollar terms.

Congress passed the Foreign Assistance Act on September 4, 1961, which reorganized U.S. foreign assistance programs and mandated the creation of an agency to administer economic aid. USAID was subsequently established by the executive order of President John F. Kennedy, who sought to unite several existing foreign assistance organizations and programs under one agency.[6] USAID became the first U.S. foreign assistance organization whose primary focus was long-term socioeconomic development.

USAID's programs are authorized by Congress in the Foreign Assistance Act,[7] which Congress supplements through directions in annual funding appropriation acts and other legislation. As an official component of U.S. foreign policy, USAID operates subject to the guidance of the President, Secretary of State, and the National Security Council.[8] USAID has missions in over 100 countries, primarily in Africa, Asia, Latin America, the Middle East, and Eastern Europe.
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wesk
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2020 10:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The introductory title to this post tainted the well for the follow-on discussion. The plate is an USAID plate not a US Military Assistance Program Plate. These are two entirely different programs administered by two separate government agencies. Also there is no such animal as
Quote:
"Willys Military Assistance Program"


It would help if the poster changed his title from
Quote:
"Willys Military Assistance Program Plate"
which this plate is clearly not, to
Quote:
" USAID Plate"

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SK
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2020 3:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

wesk wrote:
The introductory title to this post tainted the well for the follow-on discussion. The plate is an USAID plate not a US Military Assistance Program Plate. These are two entirely different programs administered by two separate government agencies. Also there is no such animal as
Quote:
"Willys Military Assistance Program"


It would help if the poster changed his title from
Quote:
"Willys Military Assistance Program Plate"
which this plate is clearly not, to
Quote:
" USAID Plate"



Thanks for the correction. I have changed the subject name.
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SK
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2020 3:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RonD2 wrote:
Very interesting find!

Curious, is that plate riveted to an engine? Or frame? Or body?

Too bad there's no date on it (when the jeep was "donated"), and who (what country) it was donated to.

I always thought that USAID provides surplus U.S. Government Property to counterpart civilian agencies of friendly foreign governments, but not for the military. USAID donating tanks and guns too? Didn't the CIA run guns through USAID in SEA during the 1960's and 1970's, or is that urban legend? I thought "Military Assistance" wasn't handled by USAID, but could be mistaken.


It is riveted on glove box.
I don't know the exact date, but this jeep was donated during the late 50's or early 60's and the country is Pakistan.


Last edited by SK on Sun Aug 16, 2020 7:58 pm; edited 2 times in total
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SK
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2020 3:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear Ryan,
Can you tell me what exactly
Quote:
1
and
Quote:
UP
stamped on this plate telling?
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wesk
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2020 9:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello Sher Kahn,

Quote:
I don't know the exact date, but this jeep was donated during the late 50's and the country is Pakistan.

The USAID program was started in 1961. So 1961 is the earliest date that plate could have been produced.

With very secretive organizations like USAID and MAP I doubt there will be much access to their internal operating systems to analyse stampings on a plate.

If I were to make a wild guess on their meanings the "1" would probably represent a function or certain enterprise within the USAID system. The "UP" at the bottom might refer to the program under which the donation was made.

There have been a dozen or so Pakistani based M38's that have shown up on this and other web sites over the past few years.

I noticed we had a discussion in June on this topic. I see from message I sent you in June why you tied military assistance and that tag together. I'll correct that message to eliminate the confusion.



Your M38 has a generic dash serial plate that has been stamped in the field with a numeral stamp set that does not match the set used by Willys factory. So either your jeep does not belong to that USAID tag or your jeep has the wrong dash serial plate tag on it.

One more question that will help level the playing field here. Are old vehicles in Pakistan registered or titled with the local government agency using their body/chassis serial numbers or their engine serial numbers?
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whydahdvr
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2020 11:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wes and SK, et al.

Regards to when that M38, or others, may have been delivered to Pakistan and for what aid program I would start within Pakistan and with public records. While I don't know what's shared and public information in Pakistan vs what's kept secret the US has had a long history of aid to Pakistan, especially from the time when India was more closely allied with Russia and had a socialist government.
I would look through public records, news reports, those kinds of filings to narrow down what aid was delivered to Pakistan and when. I would also look at past geopolitical events to help narrow that timeframe down.

Basic research.....

Good luck!
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RonD2
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2020 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One more kind of obvious question out of curiosity: where is this M38 today? Still in Pakistan?

A great thread on M38 history I must say!
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SK
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2020 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Wesk,

Quote:
With very secretive organizations like USAID and MAP I doubt there will be much access to their internal operating systems to analyse stampings on a plate.

Is there anyway to clear this doubt?

Quote:
The "UP" at the bottom might refer to the program under which the donation was made.

What actually UP stands for?

Yes, the dash serial plate tag is the wrong one and it was added to this jeep later. I have removed it, but the USAID plate belongs to my jeep.

Quote:
Are old vehicles in Pakistan registered or titled with the local government agency using their body/chassis serial numbers or their engine serial numbers?

It depends on excise & taxation dept. of different provinces of Pakistan, some are registered through body/chassis serial number or engine serial number or both.


Last edited by SK on Tue Aug 18, 2020 4:41 am; edited 1 time in total
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SK
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2020 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

whydahdvr,

Quote:
Regards to when that M38, or others, may have been delivered to Pakistan and for what aid program I would start within Pakistan and with public records. I would look through public records, news reports, those kinds of filings to narrow down what aid was delivered to Pakistan and when. I would also look at past geopolitical events to help narrow that time frame down.

Sir, I request you please search for it as it will be a great aid for me to have such information and particularly of my jeep (MC-71480) also.
I would be grateful to you.

________
Regards,
SK
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whydahdvr
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 18, 2020 7:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SK, you're in Pakistan, right?

That being true, you're much better positioned to research. Just because it's a US agency and program doesn't mean much was published here in the US on their specific aid packages. That would be in government archives.

Pakistan, as the recipient, would have a lot more details on that. Somewhere in the Pakistani government that was tracked at some level. I have no idea what information, government publications, or news agencies/services are in Pakistan and what may still be in operation today as in the 1960s or 70s.

I would start online doing internet searches there and with the major news services. Then I would reach out to the Pakistani government and explain what you're doing - researching the history of your jeep. My impression of the Pakistani government is they're suspicious of what they consider odd information requests. However, I'm sure they have some citizen facing and focused group that you could start with.

You could also write the USAID themselves, explain your research objective, and see if they can help you.

Inshallah
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