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willysmjeeps.com :: View topic - King pin clarifications please
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King pin clarifications please

 
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arisLgr
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Joined: Dec 25, 2016
Posts: 97
Location: Athens, Greece

PostPosted: Wed May 11, 2022 10:13 am    Post subject: King pin clarifications please Reply with quote

Hi all!
1. TORQUE. Since I have not found a composite complete torque chart for our M38, I located here a chart link for the CJ2A ( http://www.cj-2a.com/techtips/specs/torques.html ) where it indicates for the kingpins 55 to 65 which to me seems very much, if that is lbs/si.
Elsewhere on posts I read 25lbs that seems more correct, which is the correct one?

2. SHIMS. some charts show shims at the top king pin only and others show shims both for the top as well as at the bottom, with a note that the total of the shims should be divided between them. Which is the correct one ?

Thanks ahead, Aris!
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Aris
Willys M38
1936 Cord Phaeton
1954 Mercury Monterey
1968 Corvette Stingray
1973 Mercedes 350SE
1974 Montesa Cota 247T
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wesk
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Posts: 15813
Location: Wisconsin

PostPosted: Wed May 11, 2022 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As a general rule and an accepted industry standard if a repair manual entry does not specify a torque for a fastener then you simply determine the fastener size, pitch and SAE grade then refer to a reliable General Torques Chart and select the indicated torque value. Since the M38 repair manuals do not offer a general torque chart you must shop the web for a good source. Here is one I use often:



In the SM-1002 R5 Willys factory CJ manual there is a specific torques chart:




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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php
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RonD2
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Joined: Oct 02, 2014
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Location: South Carolina, Dorchester County

PostPosted: Wed May 11, 2022 2:59 pm    Post subject: Re: King pin clarifications please Reply with quote

arisLgr wrote:
2. SHIMS. some charts show shims at the top king pin only and others show shims both for the top as well as at the bottom, with a note that the total of the shims should be divided between them. Which is the correct one ?

Hi Aris,
You should read paragraph 230 starting on page 262 of the M38 manual TM9-8012.
On the M38, shims go only under the top flange cap, the quantity needed to get the correct pull tension on the knuckle.
And be careful with bolt lengths for the flange caps --- if you put the wrong length bolt into the wrong hole you'll damage the bearing.
All this is covered in paragraph 230.

Pretty sure that only the MB-GPW and the CJ2A had shims split between the top and bottom flange caps.

If you don't own and haven't read the M38 manuals you can download them free on this website.

Good luck!
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Ron D.
1951 M38 Unknown Serial Number
1951 M100 Dunbar Kapple 01169903 dod 5-51

“The only good sports car that America ever made was the Jeep."
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arisLgr
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Joined: Dec 25, 2016
Posts: 97
Location: Athens, Greece

PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2022 6:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks a million guys!!!!!
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Aris
Willys M38
1936 Cord Phaeton
1954 Mercury Monterey
1968 Corvette Stingray
1973 Mercedes 350SE
1974 Montesa Cota 247T
1982 Kubota B7100
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arisLgr
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Joined: Dec 25, 2016
Posts: 97
Location: Athens, Greece

PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2022 7:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ron yes, I did damage the top king pin bearing with the wrong bolts, that was done before I read your warning and being a typical amateur I did not RTFM (read the ..... manual) properly. ☹

More help please:
1. With new king pin cone bearings can I use the old races?
2. I find the Brass Bearing P/N 7375045 on the Spindle having a bit of play in the Shaft, I’ll try to find them locally, if not is there a specification for this play so I can decide if they are good to stay?
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Aris
Willys M38
1936 Cord Phaeton
1954 Mercury Monterey
1968 Corvette Stingray
1973 Mercedes 350SE
1974 Montesa Cota 247T
1982 Kubota B7100
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wesk
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Joined: Apr 04, 2005
Posts: 15813
Location: Wisconsin

PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2022 8:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

1 - No

2 - Generally in the .002 to .004 range.

Here's a link to a site that offers the answer based on your measurements.

https://materion.com/resource-center/tools-and-calculators/toughmet-bushing-fit-and-tolerancing-tool
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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php
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arisLgr
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Joined: Dec 25, 2016
Posts: 97
Location: Athens, Greece

PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2022 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Always to the rescue, Thanks Wes!
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Aris
Willys M38
1936 Cord Phaeton
1954 Mercury Monterey
1968 Corvette Stingray
1973 Mercedes 350SE
1974 Montesa Cota 247T
1982 Kubota B7100
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