do you think my starter is dying?

[m37m38]

at startup my starter is making a grinding noise from the front end of the starter - not at the flywheel. It stopped after about 30-45 seconds. I tried it again and got the same response. I checked the bolts to make sure it was fastened to the vehicle properly but the noise and vibration seems to be coming from the front end of the starter.

I also looked at the archives trying to see if it needed to be lubricated but did not find anything - my manuals say the lubrication should be done at rebuild but this starter is only 2 years old.

Any help is appreciated
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M37M38

1951 M38
1952 M37
1944 Ford GPW
M416

[hillbilly21]

could be the bendix going out of it

[Ryan_Miller]

I would take it off and check your ring gear teeth on the ring gear and starter are OK.

Then I would consider digging into the starter.
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Ryan Miller
MVPA # 22010

[m37m38]

it is such a pain in the ass to take out - has anybody found an easy way to get at the bolts without pulling the air filter etc....
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M37M38

1951 M38
1952 M37
1944 Ford GPW
M416

[Ryan_Miller]

Pull the fender off

Just kidding.

Some things are difficult and I don't know a better way other than going from the bottom side.

It builds character and what does not kill you makes you stronger right?

Just trying to cheer you up.
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Ryan Miller
MVPA # 22010

[wesk]

A grinding noise from the front which you described as "towards the front of the engine" is not the flywheel or bendix which is at the back of the starter. The front of the starter towards the front of the engine houses the commutator end bearing and the brushes and it would be one of those making the noise.
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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php

[m37m38]

so the question is do you run it til it dies or pull it and rebuild it now?
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M37M38

1951 M38
1952 M37
1944 Ford GPW
M416

[Ryan_Miller]

I am the kind of person that likes to have things running well.

I would pull it and fix it.
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Ryan Miller
MVPA # 22010

[wesk]

Shouldn't be any question at all. The starter has some very tough demands placed onit. The high current draw and high torques developed will cause irreparable damage if the starter is allowed to continue in service while it is so obvious there is something seriously wrong inside of it.

If you take immediate action you may be able to save the high cost of replacing any trashed parts like the armature, field coils and etc if the bearings are bad. Or the armature if the brushes or their steel holders are bad and they damage the commutator surface. A bad bearing can quickly lead to a wobbling armature which can cause the pinion gear to jump on the flywheel ring gear. A damaged ring gear means the engine comes out to replace the flywheel/ring gear.

It is much cheaper to perform preventative maintenance then it is to replace high dollar parts because we just let it go awhile longer.
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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php

[m37m38]

Thanks all - points well taken - I am off to pull a starter!!!!
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M37M38

1951 M38
1952 M37
1944 Ford GPW
M416

[wesk]

One more point. If you have the early M38 starter the pinion travel setting is critical and requires a special tool to set it. If it travels towards the flywheel too far it grinds. If it travels to far away from the flywheel it may slip or pop out of engagement also damaging the ring gear teeth. We have the overhaul and adjustments pages of TM 9-1825B loaded for that starter on my old Yahoo storage group which you must also be a member to download.
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/willys-military-mjeeps/files/TM9-1825B/










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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php

[m37m38]

ok - I took the starter to the rebuilder - and the pinion gear (i think that is the right term) has a threaded end that keeps it in place and prevents it from staying engaged to the flywheel. the nut that holds it in place is broken. I am looking in my manual which shows an exploded view of the starter and can not locate the extact part number or even the part. The closest thing I see isa yoke. Has anyone else had a similar experience or know where to locate the internal parts?

I would assume i need to find a dead starter to rob parts off of. IF so does anyone have one???
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M37M38

1951 M38
1952 M37
1944 Ford GPW
M416

[wesk]

And which M38 starter do you have?




Early M38 (1950-early 52)


Late M38 and all M38A1/M170
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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php

[m37m38]

I have the early starter
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M37M38

1951 M38
1952 M37
1944 Ford GPW
M416

[wesk]

Then it is item AC whose end is damaged. You should be using the copies of the TM 9-1825B pages I loaded on the web site for your repair work on the starter or your shop mechanic should be using it. The overunning clutch assembly (Item AC) is a sealed unit for which no repairs are approved and no individual parts are stocked. This means you need a new item AC. (Auto-Lite # MZ2244, WO# 117898, Ord# 7375106)
_________________
Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php