M38A1 body tub wanted

[onabeach]

Looking for a M38A1 tub. Would prefer original low rust but will consider anything but the one I have! Will pay cash, Paypal or possible trade involving a Ferguson tractor or ultralight airplane.
Thanks, Robert

[BullRun]

Being nearly done with the repair of a very rusted and accident damaged 1953 M38A1 tub I can tell you that unless there is serious collision damage on your tub, the best route is to restore it.

Replica M38A1 tubs hover around $4000 last time I checked making an original repaired tub very cost effective even if someone else does the work.

Nearly every piece is now available in reproduction from a variety of sources. Don't get hung up on 100% originality or you will drive your self nuts. 75% is close enough in reality. This still means having an authentic restoration.

If it is just rust it can be fixed. Many repairable bodies go to the junk yard. It does not have to be so. .

Post some pictures and I am sure you will get some free estimates!

[onabeach]

Thanks, BullRun, your comments are most appreciated.

Here are some pics of my M38A1. I have already started to repair the floors with stainless steel sheet with plywood underlayment. My original goal was was to get it roadworthy to see how the running gear was. The engine runs good and the 24 V system is functioning. The battery box is in good shape.

But I also need to replace the rear springs, front axle, exhaust and complete brake job. These things would be much easier to do with the body off. I really don't want to do a frame off restoration; just want a good looking jeep that drives well. I am retired so I have far more time than money. But I hate doing body work, so I really want a body that dosen't need much, or someone else to do the body work on this one or a replacement body. I also would like to get as much money back that I put into it when I eventually sell it.


As recieved:


repair started:


Also, has anyone seen a heater mounted outside like this:

[BullRun]

To me that looks repairable. It is rusted in the same places as most of the jeeps I have worked on. It actually sounds pretty good as the mechanicals work. It is all doable it just takes time as the work is very tedious.

You'll need new floor hat channels, driver and passenger side floorboards and a fuel tank well. Patch panels and some other floor plates and repair to the sides. If you want it back to the original look and strength. All these parts are available in reproduction. Probably a new gas tank too.

18 gauge tub and 16 gauge floor riser and thats about it. All mild steel.

A rough estimate of around $700 to $1200 for repair panels. Labor would be variable and hard to estimate as the rust is going turn out to be to be greater when disassembled. For a skilled welder/fabricator maybe about a week of work is involved here assuming nothing else gets fixed. Talk to John Bizal of Midwest Military for the best quality reproduction parts for floorboard repair. He is on here somewhere.

I would get a bodyshop/welder/fabricator to take a look at it and get some more labor and time estimates. Since so much is rusted out it will actually be quicker to repair as there is less to save.

I guess I am saying it looks pretty normal for a nearly 60 year old unrestored jeep body.

The replacement tubs need work too as they sometimes don't fit right but with some estimates it should give you a good idea of what direction to go. .

Someone once told me auto restoration is 90% bodywork and 10% mechanical. I believe it.

[DJ]

[onabeach]

Thanks again, BullRun; I've got a couple of leads on some tubs and will decide after I get more info. If I got a better tub, do you really think anyone would want mine?

Back in the 90's, I almost always made a profit when I sold my jeeps. I guess those days are over?

[BullRun]

I doubt anyone will want it but before you toss it out....

As far as I know their are no reproduction toolboxes that properly fit the M38A1. The M38A1 box and some CJ 5 tool boxes have six ribs on the top surface. The reproductions have seven. That seventh rib will not allow the handbrake to be properly mounted without some modifications to the reproduction tool box. You might have to cut the spot welds on the original tool box out and remount it for the handbrake to work.

Also, not sure about the passenger side indentation for the battery plug for jump starting on reproduction bodies. Also, the battery box parts may need swapped over and the dash panel possibly.

You have the later style body which is slightly different from the early style too if that is of importance.

There are a few other details like the bracket to hold the passenger seat in place and probably many more little details that will need addressed in a repro or replacement body even if it is original.

If you have room hold onto it... I never need something till after I throw it away... it gives you the possibility of changing your mind or including it in a future sale of the jeep to someone who might want the original body for a ground up restoration.

If not put it up for sale or give it away... someone might fix it if it is free.

And don't forget to save the data tag behind the passenger seat on the wheel housing! It might be covered over with paint.

I hope that helps.

[onabeach]

Yes, that helps alot. I'll make sure to check if it is an early or late tub. I assume you are talking about things like the bat. cover and grill mounts.

What is that little sliding latch near the left rear of the tool box lid used for? I remember it was on my M38 as well.

[wesk]

The tub never changed part numbers. The original drawings were simply amended when the later battery box lid came out and the again when the passenger seat snap lock bracket came out. There's nothing painful involved to make a late tub into and early or an early into a late. Don't let the body out of your site until you have completely assembled your new body. You'll need all kinds of little doodads off the old tub including all the floor access panels.

That little sliding bolt just aft and inboard of the tool box lid is a field expedient to latch the passenger seat down. Yes it was also added to most M38's as well. Later A1's had the snap latch passenger seat lock added by Kaiser.

I am surprised Hal hasn't mentioned his tub rebuild. He took a welding class and used the M38 as his welding class project. Other enterprising restorers have contacted their local high school Vo-tec auto shop teachers about having them use their jeep as a class project where the owner pays for materials only.
_________________
Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php

[BullRun]

Yes, I am just talking about basic differences between the early vehicles and later vehicles. You have the late tub style due to the grill support rods.

One more difference... if your vehicle is late enough it has different top bow brackets.

On a very early M38A1 I have, the same latch is used to hold the passenger seat frame in place and keep it from bouncing around. On the later style tub there is a simple spring mechanism on the rear wheelhousing that the passenger seat frame snaps into to hold the seat frame in place. The original on your vehicle probably broke and this was a quick fix.

Wes makes a good point here about keeping everything till you are done as you might need to take a measurement or just have something to compare too.

Most people I have met who used a reproduction body (if you do that), have been pretty happy with the results. Some fresh paint and a little road dust and nobody will know the difference.

[BullRun]

One more thing.

If you decide to fix your original tub do not cut out the center hump over the transmission and transfercase as this piece of metal is not available in reproduction (as far as I know) and acts as a registration reference when putting it all back together as you weld.

You will need to make patch panels to fix it.

[wesk]

The late style pass seat latch doesn't mount to the rear wheel house. It is mounted to the side panel.



The very late A1's had a different top bow forward stowage bracket.

Early


Late

Either will bolt in place on any year A1.
_________________
Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php

[BullRun]

Yes, that is right the spring is mounted to the side.

And, all these little parts are interchangeable by design for the most part.

[onabeach]

Thanks, guys. When I worry about what bow storage bracket to use, then I know I'm doing ok!

[onabeach]

Hey everyone, guess what followed me home today? A really good M38A1 tub! There is only a small amount of rust in one end of a hat channel; the tool box, floor pans, and gas tank well are all solid. There are a couple of other problems, I mean issues, though; the worst being that the rear panel "tailgate" was replaced and the rear quarter panels have large cutouts for, I guess, lights.
I'll post some pics tomorrow.